Comments on: Does Jesus the Man Save?

By: John W Frye

John W Frye — Mon, 31 Dec 2007 14:21:26 +0000

Z-man,

I believe you are on to something crucial here when you write, “So, do we need to believe in Jesus as deity for our salvation? No, we only need believe that he is our salvation. We need to believe in him as deity only in order to be in accord with God’s word.” I thnk we have a tendency to roll all theology about Jesus into the faith-to-be-saved content container. All we need believe is that Jesus is God’s sole agent of reclaiming the universe and all in it for God. Excellent thoughts, my friend.

By: Z-man

Z-man — Mon, 24 Dec 2007 01:51:24 +0000

For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only son, that whomever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. –NIV

At the simplest level, Jesus was the designated sacrificial lamb of God, given to cover the sins of Man. He had no other assignments.

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. –Matt 5:17

Your question, John, has two components: What was Jesus, and what did he need to be?

Being God’s lamb and our salvation did not require that Jesus be God. He need only be guiltless man. Our salvation requires only that we believe in him as our savior, regardless of the entirety of his nature. But, I don’t believe any mere man, even one who is begotten of God, can achieve and maintain guiltless-ness, as history shows us. Only a man who is also fully God can pull that one off.

So, do we need to believe in Jesus as deity for our salvation? No, we only need believe that he is our salvation. We need to believe in him as deity only in order to be in accord with God’s word.

By: novus•lumen | living in the tension of an emerging faith in Jesus and postmodern America » Blog Archive » What Is The Content of Faith

Fri, 07 Dec 2007 13:32:13 +0000

[...] friend and mentor John Frye over at jesus the radical pastor has a a few posts (here and here) on the content of faith. In the first post he address the fact the in Acts 2 and 10 [...]

By: John W Frye

John W Frye — Tue, 04 Dec 2007 21:40:36 +0000

Howard,
While you have presented some interesting thoughts, I am wrestling with the revealed information in Acts 2 and 10 as Peter describes Jesus. I do think that discerning “the content of faith” in the earliest church is an important issue. Thanks for stopping by and commenting.

By: howard walters

howard walters — Tue, 04 Dec 2007 19:11:09 +0000

Perhaps this isn’t so complicated if we accept that the words and phrases of the bible needn’t be parsed and systematized as propositional belief points or statements. The NT shares parts of the story of the coming of God in Jesus–the parts that God wanted recorded in written form. These stories reflect a growing awareness and understanding of Jesus and His way of life, to include His teaching. Some passages appear to contradict other passages because that was where those individuals were at in their faith journeys. Our faith and belief will always fall short of God’s truth–both propositionally and existentially. We rest, however, kept by Him and for Him. If I can trust and follow Jesus the man or Jesus the prophet or Jesus as God—whichever, however God chooses to enliven the eyes of my spirit I am blessed in Him.

By: benjamin k dodiyar

benjamin k dodiyar — Tue, 04 Dec 2007 04:29:41 +0000

Dear sir,
We are working in the remote areas of Rajasthan in India. People are facing shortage of drinking water. Hot summer is falling now. Village people are traveling miles to collect water.
Here we are running an orphanage for 25 children, pray that we need a church building and hostel building here very urgently. These children are orphan and semi orphan from tribals.

Converted people will not allow to draw water fron village wells or from handpumps. So water facility is very urgent here.

Pray for the Church Building and land, Pray for the new believers facing oppositions from their relatives and community. Rajasthan Government passed Anti-conversion bill against christian work. Our workers are working without any support from any where. Our workers are from tribal community, and working in the remote areas. Pray and support us in the ministry so that we can earn more people for Jesus from other nonchristian communities.
Pray for us. Waiting for your reply.

Pr. Benjamin K. Dodiyar.

By: Fireball McFain

Fireball McFain — Tue, 04 Dec 2007 04:20:22 +0000

Right. My mind tends to work randomly, and timelines mess with my head.

By: John W Frye

John W Frye — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 22:49:51 +0000

Fireball,
I agree that there is truly a mysterious dimension to salvation. I am trying to get my head around the post-pouring-out-the-Spirit (Acts 2) ‘content of faith’ before Paul began to wrestle with the one-ness and the three-ness of God. Peter seems content to present Jesus as a Spirit-empowered man.

By: John W Frye

John W Frye — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 22:47:14 +0000

Watchman,

How true…becoming more like Jesus does not make us more God-like; being more like Jesus makes us more fully human, as he was the fully human ’second Adam.’

By: John W Frye

John W Frye — Mon, 03 Dec 2007 22:45:28 +0000

Jeremy, Wow, you are taking this idea even further. How flexible or expandable is “the content of faith.” If these early Jewish and Gentile believers were saved without having to make a conscious assent to Jesus’ deity (which I do not deny), then, again, how “fluid” is the content of faith??